ILLY is wise...
and with all the assumptions it does help with an estimate
(assume)
Production Vs Retail
Moderator: moderators
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Guest
you need level 90 gold tech to make Q30 gold, which you'll sell for atleast 350
in one hour you make (level Trillionaire, max size mine)
22.619,10 stones
6.785,73 gold
to produce stones you need
5 kWh Power X 0.27
1 Liter Water X 0.27
0.29c
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1.91 total price X 22.619,10 = 43202.481 (total expences)
610715.7 (profit from selling) - 43202.481 = 567513.219 (net profit.)
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to produce gold you need
850 kWh Power X 0.27
90 Liter Water X 0.27
4.5c
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258.3 total price X 6.785,73 = 1752754.059 (expences)
2375005.5 (profit from selling) - 1752754.059 = 622251.441 (net profit)
=====================================
I used production costs for tycoon (couldn't find Trillionaires)
in one hour you make (level Trillionaire, max size mine)
22.619,10 stones
6.785,73 gold
to produce stones you need
5 kWh Power X 0.27
1 Liter Water X 0.27
0.29c
--------
1.91 total price X 22.619,10 = 43202.481 (total expences)
610715.7 (profit from selling) - 43202.481 = 567513.219 (net profit.)
==========
to produce gold you need
850 kWh Power X 0.27
90 Liter Water X 0.27
4.5c
----------
258.3 total price X 6.785,73 = 1752754.059 (expences)
2375005.5 (profit from selling) - 1752754.059 = 622251.441 (net profit)
=====================================
I used production costs for tycoon (couldn't find Trillionaires)
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Guest
JoineriesAzer Productions wrote:How are my Joinery and Furiture stores off? Which point of my calculation is off? (Total output/storage space is currect. The buying and selling prices are the average from a number of very large companies on Realm 1.)
How it is possible to produce 50Q wardrobes? Let say you have 140Q wardrobes research and buying 60Q wood in such big quantities, you need 5-6 full expanded daily supliers of quality wood
Is it realistic? Try to use something more realistic like Q120 wardrobes research and Q30 wood. Then its possible to produce 30-40Q wardrobes. Ant leave at least one slot for RC.Furniture Stores
Unfortunetly now i have no active stories to test real current profit per minute. But my doubt is in the selling rate then the price is 9000. My last calculations showed that sell rate will not so high as you espect. But right now i can't prove it
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Guest
The problem in Retail vs. Production is that there are so unbelievably many people out there that do not understand profit calculations and thus sell at insane prices.
I'm assuming Trillionaire Level and 1 Fully expanded facility to make the point)
The Oil Producer produces 5089 oil per hour. Current Market price is 150c for Q48 (which is 135c bearing in mind the 10% market fee). Production cost per oil is around 40c.
Total Profit per hour: 483,484c
The Gas Producer produces 15,268 gas per hour. Current Market price is 100c for Q48 (which is 90c with the 10% fee). Production cost per gas is around 32c when he buys the oil for the 150c.
Total Profit per hour: 896,989c
The Gas station guy buys the gas for 100c from the market and puts it in the gas stations for around 120c (that's even a low guess) for 24 hours.
Total Profit per hour: 1,365,292c
This in itself is a pretty drastic picture. If you now add into the picture, that both the oil producer and the gas producer have already spent 1,083,916,800c in their respective research, it becomes even more dramatic!
Now this alone shows how unbalanced the Kapilands (at least Realm 2) economy is. In the real world, most people would switch to being gas station owners, thus making oil and gas scarce and driving up the price (or at least the oil and gas producers would do their calculations and comfortably increase their prices).
But anyway, there is a lot more things broken in Realm 2 anyways so I have given up complaining
I'm assuming Trillionaire Level and 1 Fully expanded facility to make the point)
The Oil Producer produces 5089 oil per hour. Current Market price is 150c for Q48 (which is 135c bearing in mind the 10% market fee). Production cost per oil is around 40c.
Total Profit per hour: 483,484c
The Gas Producer produces 15,268 gas per hour. Current Market price is 100c for Q48 (which is 90c with the 10% fee). Production cost per gas is around 32c when he buys the oil for the 150c.
Total Profit per hour: 896,989c
The Gas station guy buys the gas for 100c from the market and puts it in the gas stations for around 120c (that's even a low guess) for 24 hours.
Total Profit per hour: 1,365,292c
This in itself is a pretty drastic picture. If you now add into the picture, that both the oil producer and the gas producer have already spent 1,083,916,800c in their respective research, it becomes even more dramatic!
Now this alone shows how unbalanced the Kapilands (at least Realm 2) economy is. In the real world, most people would switch to being gas station owners, thus making oil and gas scarce and driving up the price (or at least the oil and gas producers would do their calculations and comfortably increase their prices).
But anyway, there is a lot more things broken in Realm 2 anyways so I have given up complaining
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Guest
Good morning - heres my view on things
Retailing or producing - either way you are depending on other players unless you do both. Security ALWAYS decreases profits.
Huge shop owners will start having problems once huge suppliers decide to stop playing (or many small ones, but I think this unlikely - unless, seen it elsewhere after a new design implemented - to have a huge effect IF it should happen).
Another thing I have seen happening there was players concentrating on one DEAD profitable part of retailing and did both: forgot to consider the growing gap between production capacity and retailing capacity combined with erm... Am I allowed to call it scroogyness of buyers/retailers? Added to this producers taking the prices in the warehouse into calculations how profitable a product is (BIG mistake like mentioned very often) and selling goods at prices which did not leave much space to do necessary expansions or researches. It takes, obviously here as well, two to tango.
Dopamin
Retailing or producing - either way you are depending on other players unless you do both. Security ALWAYS decreases profits.
Huge shop owners will start having problems once huge suppliers decide to stop playing (or many small ones, but I think this unlikely - unless, seen it elsewhere after a new design implemented - to have a huge effect IF it should happen).
Another thing I have seen happening there was players concentrating on one DEAD profitable part of retailing and did both: forgot to consider the growing gap between production capacity and retailing capacity combined with erm... Am I allowed to call it scroogyness of buyers/retailers? Added to this producers taking the prices in the warehouse into calculations how profitable a product is (BIG mistake like mentioned very often) and selling goods at prices which did not leave much space to do necessary expansions or researches. It takes, obviously here as well, two to tango.
Dopamin
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Guest
Wardrobes THE FACTS
Stores:
65.534 wardrobes
Q27
Sold @ 5500 ea
Takes 70 hours.
That is:
22468.8 Wardrobes a store a day.
You got 100 fully expanded stores
That would make:
2246880 Wardrobes a day.
Say you buy at 2600+60q (the normal price in realm 1)
They will cost you:
4220 ea.
So in total it will be:
9.481.833.600
And you will gain:
12.357.840.000
For every Higher Q you buy your selling price increases with 100.
To make an extra 10 ea profit on each wardrobe.
Profit daily:
2.876.006.400 + 89.875.200*Q
Wardrobes Production
Now lets do the Wardrobes production:
We have Q27 wardrobes for sale so we have at least Q108 research (Based on my ingame facts so far).
@ Level Trillionair
A joinery at size 32.767m2 gives us a daily production of:
25.271,00 Wardrobes.
That would make
2.527.100 Wardrobes daily.
Now we need to production costs:
Each wardrobes required 20 wood 5 steel 600 power and 18.00+0.24*Q
Wood = 75 ea
Steel = 135 ea
Power = 0.27 ea
Price to produce a single wardrobe is:
2355 + 0.96*Q
We sell at the price of:
2600+60Q
So we take the assumption that we are already making Q27 wardrobes.
Production costs daily:
6.016.822.932
Sale prices daily:
10.664.362.000
Profit increase with Q increase is:
(60-0.96)*2.527.100 * Q = 149.199.984
Profit daily
4.647.539.068+149.199.984*Q
Outcome result:
Production of wardrobes is better at this moment than Retailing them.
As long as the wardrobe buying prices are this high
Ps: Will make an excel file to let you calculate all the things yourself and see at which price and Q the profits are best
Stores:
65.534 wardrobes
Q27
Sold @ 5500 ea
Takes 70 hours.
That is:
22468.8 Wardrobes a store a day.
You got 100 fully expanded stores
That would make:
2246880 Wardrobes a day.
Say you buy at 2600+60q (the normal price in realm 1)
They will cost you:
4220 ea.
So in total it will be:
9.481.833.600
And you will gain:
12.357.840.000
For every Higher Q you buy your selling price increases with 100.
To make an extra 10 ea profit on each wardrobe.
Profit daily:
2.876.006.400 + 89.875.200*Q
Wardrobes Production
Now lets do the Wardrobes production:
We have Q27 wardrobes for sale so we have at least Q108 research (Based on my ingame facts so far).
@ Level Trillionair
A joinery at size 32.767m2 gives us a daily production of:
25.271,00 Wardrobes.
That would make
2.527.100 Wardrobes daily.
Now we need to production costs:
Each wardrobes required 20 wood 5 steel 600 power and 18.00+0.24*Q
Wood = 75 ea
Steel = 135 ea
Power = 0.27 ea
Price to produce a single wardrobe is:
2355 + 0.96*Q
We sell at the price of:
2600+60Q
So we take the assumption that we are already making Q27 wardrobes.
Production costs daily:
6.016.822.932
Sale prices daily:
10.664.362.000
Profit increase with Q increase is:
(60-0.96)*2.527.100 * Q = 149.199.984
Profit daily
4.647.539.068+149.199.984*Q
Outcome result:
Production of wardrobes is better at this moment than Retailing them.
As long as the wardrobe buying prices are this high
Ps: Will make an excel file to let you calculate all the things yourself and see at which price and Q the profits are best
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Guest
Here is the excel file
http://www.2shared.com/file/10159594/33 ... robes.html
It is clean, but feel free to scan it.
and read carefully so that you do not edit things that arent supposed to be edited.
http://www.2shared.com/file/10159594/33 ... robes.html
It is clean, but feel free to scan it.
and read carefully so that you do not edit things that arent supposed to be edited.
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Guest
Very true my fiend. And it would remain this way for some time. Reason is that more and more producers are moving to retailing. That pushes up demand.firefinal1 wrote: Outcome result:
Production of wardrobes is better at this moment than Retailing them.
As long as the wardrobe buying prices are this high
Also, increases in production capacity declines with size. That makes it difficult for producers to keep up with growing demand.
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Guest
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Guest
i have created a formula to find the profits of all productionbuilding per square meter. I did this in realm 2 about a year ago before i went on my round the world trip and this is what i found:
Production Buildings:
Leather Jackets
Pullovers
Wardrobes
Golden Watches
Diamond Rings
Gas was number 7.
However, i then recognized that this did not take into account he expansion time, cost, different needs for research (leather jackets quality is /4 and gas /3).
After accounting for this - which i am not putting in here as it would take too long.
Gas became number 2. Golden Watches no. 1
note: I could not find an acceptable price for selling Golden Watches, so i just split the profit between the Jeweler and the Jewel Factory. (This will just increase the difference between 1 and 2 (which is incredibly small with my current assumptions)).
This was 1 year ago. I am currently in the process of fixing everything up and have so far been surprised at the changes. Also just recently a business partner inspired an idea of how to incorporate sales buildings into the spreadsheet.
So Production Vs Retail?
I have found that producing is better until a certain level is reached at which time retail is surpasses it. This is because of the decreased production that occurs when each time a new level is reached. (Yes this did include building optimization).
Production Buildings:
Leather Jackets
Pullovers
Wardrobes
Golden Watches
Diamond Rings
Gas was number 7.
However, i then recognized that this did not take into account he expansion time, cost, different needs for research (leather jackets quality is /4 and gas /3).
After accounting for this - which i am not putting in here as it would take too long.
Gas became number 2. Golden Watches no. 1
note: I could not find an acceptable price for selling Golden Watches, so i just split the profit between the Jeweler and the Jewel Factory. (This will just increase the difference between 1 and 2 (which is incredibly small with my current assumptions)).
This was 1 year ago. I am currently in the process of fixing everything up and have so far been surprised at the changes. Also just recently a business partner inspired an idea of how to incorporate sales buildings into the spreadsheet.
So Production Vs Retail?
I have found that producing is better until a certain level is reached at which time retail is surpasses it. This is because of the decreased production that occurs when each time a new level is reached. (Yes this did include building optimization).
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Guest
Well,
as somebody mentioned before, leaving full production and turning into full retailing will not work from one day to the other - it will take time. Tell us about it, I needed a break because I was quite annoyed by ... many things, really the expansion times of my facs and shops were only one bit out the lot...
I have to admit I am rather the type of player guessing than calculating properly (still works out somehow more or less). Production vs retail. Whats better? This question will in my opinion never be answered satisfyingly due to the balance of demand and supply and changing from one field to the other costs money rather than gain any, unless there is a demand for the facilities you want to get rid of. If not, well, it will be some money going down the drain... Thats why I decided not to stick to one field, but to research and produce many things (though my warehouse is sometimes *censored* me off), there is always one field where there is a greater than supply... You all know what comes after that...
And this demand/supply balance keeps changing, so there can never be THE answer given. At the moment it might be quite profitable to sell wardrobes (the surplus I guess) to other players - soon enough this might change again when I look through the topics in "building trade R2" - the more people retailing in one field the higher the risk that retailing prices go down and guess what will follow...
While nearly everybody is/was retailing highly profitable wardrobes I put beds in my shops. Might not have been the only one who was responsible for beds to hit maximum stats in Germany that time... Still have to learn a lot about these stats thingys anyway...
Dopamin
as somebody mentioned before, leaving full production and turning into full retailing will not work from one day to the other - it will take time. Tell us about it, I needed a break because I was quite annoyed by ... many things, really the expansion times of my facs and shops were only one bit out the lot...
I have to admit I am rather the type of player guessing than calculating properly (still works out somehow more or less). Production vs retail. Whats better? This question will in my opinion never be answered satisfyingly due to the balance of demand and supply and changing from one field to the other costs money rather than gain any, unless there is a demand for the facilities you want to get rid of. If not, well, it will be some money going down the drain... Thats why I decided not to stick to one field, but to research and produce many things (though my warehouse is sometimes *censored* me off), there is always one field where there is a greater than supply... You all know what comes after that...
And this demand/supply balance keeps changing, so there can never be THE answer given. At the moment it might be quite profitable to sell wardrobes (the surplus I guess) to other players - soon enough this might change again when I look through the topics in "building trade R2" - the more people retailing in one field the higher the risk that retailing prices go down and guess what will follow...
While nearly everybody is/was retailing highly profitable wardrobes I put beds in my shops. Might not have been the only one who was responsible for beds to hit maximum stats in Germany that time... Still have to learn a lot about these stats thingys anyway...
Dopamin
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Guest
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Guest
Has producing really won? I would not say so, though it might look like it at the moment... I do both so I have an income no matter if market prices fluctuate. Stats fluctuate, too, but in every shop I can sell a few things if I have them on stock... I can decide what I produce and what I sell in the shops. Might not be the most profitable option, but includes a lot of security...ILIYYILI wrote:producing won,
retail lost.
end topic?
It always depends on the current situation. I have seen wooden toys on the market at prices I could not believe. Things like these change - no I would not put money into a toy shop anymore since I sold mine...
Dopamin