of course i dont expect you to admit it to the world because of your pride but still ... anyway in time you might be even considered my smartest student 
Power Plant were to put it
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Guest
oh good you are starting to move in the right direction - and quite quickly to be honest. if you continue this way you will even admit to yourself that the numbnuts was right for the right reasons of course i dont expect you to admit it to the world because of your pride but still ... anyway in time you might be even considered my smartest student
of course i dont expect you to admit it to the world because of your pride but still ... anyway in time you might be even considered my smartest student -
Guest
No numbnuts you where wrong in your reasoning... just right in conclusion because of the 60 (100) unit limit).
If own use is the focus then market price isn't a factor... you'd simply build less red powerplants to cover your usage. Which isn't an issue where there is no cap in unit # but where there is then you have to factor in what else that slot would be used for.
In ACTUAL economics unit cost is king.
If own use is the focus then market price isn't a factor... you'd simply build less red powerplants to cover your usage. Which isn't an issue where there is no cap in unit # but where there is then you have to factor in what else that slot would be used for.
In ACTUAL economics unit cost is king.
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I completely dissagree. You HAVE to pay EACH product and building. If you make power it is worth the market price.Ravenstar Corp wrote:If you are Only producing power for your own use then market price is irrelivant, the only thing that is relivant there is base cost per unit... which in green is 0.01 in red the unit cost is 0.3 300% more which doesn't cover the upside of having 25% more production.
Lets bring out the old cattle example:
30 kg Corn
350 Liter Water
2.25 production cost
30 corn X 3.5 = 105
350 water X .25 = 87.5
Production Cost - 2.25
Total = 194.75
Price of cattle on the market = 150
As you can see, you are LOSING money by producing cattle. You could have sold all the parts and, not only, made more money but had an extra building space.
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If your business is power then sure... if not then your main requirement (Disregarding unit#cap) is lowest unit price for your power.... you factor in market price when deciding on profitability of your OTHER facilitys but it has no bareing on whether you are better off with red or green for your powerplant. you are always better off with the lowest unit price (Which is green)
However because of the game having a limit of 60(100) unit slots then the saved unit slots from the 25% extra production enter into play....
Sure you charge your other units whatever the market price is... but that has no bareing on your Plant placement choise. In real world economics it would be whatever gave you lowest unit cost, in the game it is whatever takes up less slots whilst covering your power needs.
(Unless you decide not to produce your own power at all and use all the slots elsewhere... market price WILL of course effect THAT decision)
However because of the game having a limit of 60(100) unit slots then the saved unit slots from the 25% extra production enter into play....
Sure you charge your other units whatever the market price is... but that has no bareing on your Plant placement choise. In real world economics it would be whatever gave you lowest unit cost, in the game it is whatever takes up less slots whilst covering your power needs.
(Unless you decide not to produce your own power at all and use all the slots elsewhere... market price WILL of course effect THAT decision)
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Ill chime in here, I know its long but ill sum up at the bottom
Unit cost is most certainly a factor but if your producing for yourself or buying is irrelevant on what type you build. If you produce power for 0.01ea and using if you still have the same costs/profits as if you sold it, if you use it you lose the 0.10ea could could have sold it for. Ergo it still costs 0.10ea to make it no matter if you produce or buy.
The ultimate factor is the long-term profits, assume one PP makes 100 power in green:125 in Red.
100x0.09=9.00
125x0.07=8.75
So Green is better?
Yes and no, in the short term yup Green is best
If we increase in lots of 1k and start with a 1k PP in both areas (to make the calcs easy)
With Time taken to make enough money to expand
RED
1000>2000 = 488h
2000>3000 = 325h
3000>4000 = 271h
Green
1000>2000 = 401h
2000>3000 = 267h
3000>4000 = 222h
Ok Green still wins; jump forward to 9k>10k
Red = 174h
Green = 147h
20k>21k
RED = 123h
Green = 110h
Seems to speak for itself
In summation Green is ultimately the better station all round because even if you get to 37k the 0.02 difference in price will still mean Green is better.
BUT hears the shocker
100 x 0.24 = 24c
125 x 0.22 = 27.5c
Much higher than 0.10ea the 0.02 difference becomes irrelevant because the 25% extra makes up for it. (Its still takes longer to get a RED PP to 37k at 0.25ea though just by a smaller margin)
My summation: Red is better in R1, Green is better in R2 (At least at current prices so if you plan ahead buy RED rhymes dont it
)
H
Unit cost is most certainly a factor but if your producing for yourself or buying is irrelevant on what type you build. If you produce power for 0.01ea and using if you still have the same costs/profits as if you sold it, if you use it you lose the 0.10ea could could have sold it for. Ergo it still costs 0.10ea to make it no matter if you produce or buy.
The ultimate factor is the long-term profits, assume one PP makes 100 power in green:125 in Red.
100x0.09=9.00
125x0.07=8.75
So Green is better?
Yes and no, in the short term yup Green is best
If we increase in lots of 1k and start with a 1k PP in both areas (to make the calcs easy)
With Time taken to make enough money to expand
RED
1000>2000 = 488h
2000>3000 = 325h
3000>4000 = 271h
Green
1000>2000 = 401h
2000>3000 = 267h
3000>4000 = 222h
Ok Green still wins; jump forward to 9k>10k
Red = 174h
Green = 147h
20k>21k
RED = 123h
Green = 110h
Seems to speak for itself
In summation Green is ultimately the better station all round because even if you get to 37k the 0.02 difference in price will still mean Green is better.
BUT hears the shocker
100 x 0.24 = 24c
125 x 0.22 = 27.5c
Much higher than 0.10ea the 0.02 difference becomes irrelevant because the 25% extra makes up for it. (Its still takes longer to get a RED PP to 37k at 0.25ea though just by a smaller margin)
My summation: Red is better in R1, Green is better in R2 (At least at current prices so if you plan ahead buy RED rhymes dont it
)H
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Guest
HH you are missing My point.
Market cost certainly plays a part in deciding wether you produce your own power or not.... also in wether you aim to be an energy prodcuing company and selling power to others.
However regarding a company that has decided to produce its own power but is NOT looking to enter the power market then market cost is irrelevant in choosing wether to build in red or green.
Such a companys profit will come from its other slots, ergo the less slots it needs to use to cover its overall power usage the better, in house power unit cost of 0.03 or 0.01 doesn't matter, it is still cheaper than buying power in.... if it wasn't then no one would produce their own, only those who decided to be power producers for everyone else OR everyone would buy @ 0.27 from the NPC.
You have a limited number of slots 60 or 100....Red uses less slots, thats more slots left in which to make a profitable company.
As said, you charge your OTHER buildings Market value for the energy in deciding wether they are profitable or not but you have ALREADY decided to cover your energy in house, that decision takes out the effect of the market on your power plant placement choise... you need however many it takes to cover your energy needs, end of.... and red does that in less slots... any company WILL grow to fill all 60 (100) slots ergo long term it will be better to build in red... regardless of market price.
Market cost certainly plays a part in deciding wether you produce your own power or not.... also in wether you aim to be an energy prodcuing company and selling power to others.
However regarding a company that has decided to produce its own power but is NOT looking to enter the power market then market cost is irrelevant in choosing wether to build in red or green.
Such a companys profit will come from its other slots, ergo the less slots it needs to use to cover its overall power usage the better, in house power unit cost of 0.03 or 0.01 doesn't matter, it is still cheaper than buying power in.... if it wasn't then no one would produce their own, only those who decided to be power producers for everyone else OR everyone would buy @ 0.27 from the NPC.
You have a limited number of slots 60 or 100....Red uses less slots, thats more slots left in which to make a profitable company.
As said, you charge your OTHER buildings Market value for the energy in deciding wether they are profitable or not but you have ALREADY decided to cover your energy in house, that decision takes out the effect of the market on your power plant placement choise... you need however many it takes to cover your energy needs, end of.... and red does that in less slots... any company WILL grow to fill all 60 (100) slots ergo long term it will be better to build in red... regardless of market price.
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Like podge said, it costs you money to produce your own power. (More than you save by producing your own power.)
Take a few minutes and read the following link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparitive_advantage
Take a few minutes and read the following link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparitive_advantage
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Guest
The value of your power is obviously marketprice, in general.
Treat it as if you could have sold it on the market and calculate that in your endproduct, that way you are sure to always make a profit based on real value
By only buying power and not make any of your own means you will have slots available for other purposes, but there is a risk to be totally depended on the market, if the powerprice gets very high then certain products are gonna cost too much to make a decent profit (jewelry for example), therefor I also produce my own power.
I look how much I could have sold the power for, minus the 10% marketfee and that is calculated in my endproduct.
Sometimes when powerprice on the market is high I downsize that price a bit in my endproduct.
(Even if I know that power at that moment is worth more, I choose to downsize it for the purpose of my endproduct.)
Yes I could have sold the power for 0,25 (for instance) but then I would have no power
and I would have to shut down my jewelfactory.
So I say it is worth 0,17.
Point is, as long as you ad some profit to the power you produce and calculate that in your endproduct you will make a profit and pay your building too.
And it doesn't have to be marketvalue as a rigid rule, just as long as you dont forget to ad profit to your warehouse productioncost you will make money.
I have a mix of green and red powerplants and my average warehouse productioncost is still 0,01.
That is why I think a mix is good.
Treat it as if you could have sold it on the market and calculate that in your endproduct, that way you are sure to always make a profit based on real value
By only buying power and not make any of your own means you will have slots available for other purposes, but there is a risk to be totally depended on the market, if the powerprice gets very high then certain products are gonna cost too much to make a decent profit (jewelry for example), therefor I also produce my own power.
I look how much I could have sold the power for, minus the 10% marketfee and that is calculated in my endproduct.
Sometimes when powerprice on the market is high I downsize that price a bit in my endproduct.
(Even if I know that power at that moment is worth more, I choose to downsize it for the purpose of my endproduct.)
Yes I could have sold the power for 0,25 (for instance) but then I would have no power
and I would have to shut down my jewelfactory.So I say it is worth 0,17.
Point is, as long as you ad some profit to the power you produce and calculate that in your endproduct you will make a profit and pay your building too.
And it doesn't have to be marketvalue as a rigid rule, just as long as you dont forget to ad profit to your warehouse productioncost you will make money.
I have a mix of green and red powerplants and my average warehouse productioncost is still 0,01.
That is why I think a mix is good.
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the rounded down cost ... but the red one still costs 0.03 to produce, therefore you must have less than 1/4 of your power produced in red areasally wrote: I have a mix of green and red powerplants and my average warehouse productioncost is still 0,01.
and in the absolute sense, producing 1mil power from 1/4 red and 3/4 green still costs you 15000 caps, not 10000 caps even if the warehouse says its 0.01. its funny people in their 40's dont know the basic maths
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That is a point on which I think we are ALL agreedpodge wrote:I'll try and put it another way
I think what most are trying to say is it is not always cost effective to produce your own power.
If you want to be self sufficient power wise it will most likely cost you money.
Like sally I don't want to have my profitability calculations at the mercy of a variable market therefore a few of My unit slots will go towards Red powerplants (Therefore covering My power needs with the fewest number of slots used). That stability is, for Me, worth the potential loss in overall profit from not using those slots on other things but giving Me a stable 0.03 power cost.
(When calculating other unit profitability I tend to use 0.1 for ease of calculation and to pay myself for My powerplant)
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