Steel

[Guest]

We need someone who can see behind the scenes to know for sure. If all we had were players guessing and boycotting that's kind of a mob justice.

Big Brother knows best, eh? Also, "mob justice" involves lynchings and stuff, and a boycott is pretty far from lynching.

Considering you can still progress in solo mode, and you can't keep people from buying off the market, I don't think that's a viable solution.

If you progress in solo mode and nobody knows about it, does it matter? And what does it matter if a cheater buys from the market? It's the selling that a boycott would prevent, and if a cheater cannot sell in the market, he can only sell in his own stores.

Really, if the developers were smart, they would sell multi-accounting accounts (cf. Premium Account) for a few dozen coins per month...

[BuffaloSabres]

well their isn't one person selling steel better than the NPC's price right know. Thats brutal. The closest is 136.

[Guest]

well their isn't one person selling steel better than the NPC's price right know. Thats brutal. The closest is 136.

Ever considered buying it from NPC then instead of complaining about it? It seems your cheapest option to me if nobody wants to supply you with steel for less than 136

[Guest]

well their isn't one person selling steel better than the NPC's price right know. Thats brutal. The closest is 136.

On the rare occassion I make it, mine goes for 170c. q0 sellers are losing out anyway if they put steel on the market, so I don't see the point in making the npc price into a problem.

[Guest]

well their isn't one person selling steel better than the NPC's price right know. Thats brutal. The closest is 136.

On the rare occassion I make it, mine goes for 170c. q0 sellers are losing out anyway if they put steel on the market, so I don't see the point in making the npc price into a problem.

i think u should stop making it then ... lol ... cause when i make it, its price is around 25-30c

[Guest]

well their isn't one person selling steel better than the NPC's price right know. Thats brutal. The closest is 136.

On the rare occassion I make it, mine goes for 170c. q0 sellers are losing out anyway if they put steel on the market, so I don't see the point in making the npc price into a problem.

i think u should stop making it then ... lol ... cause when i make it, its price is around 25-30c

I sell it on the market for 170c. Production price is 29-32c.

[Guest]

Well to his credit that's what Tycoon said right from the beginning. If you're worried about the NPC squeezing your prices, start raising quality so you can charge more.

[Guest]

so datadyne you sell it for 5.7 its cost, wow. You sure make a lot of profit.

[Guest]

The way I see it, rules are rules, and we all have to work within them. The biggest flaw in boycotting someones wares on the markets is that is is fairly straight forward to build your company by being completely self sufficient. At present, that is my way and I very rarely trade on the market to purchase or sell, boycotting me on the market would have little impact.

Similarly, if I was being boycotted, then I would lower the prices of my wares to a point that someone would be tempted, lower profit sales are better than no sales. The mob only rules in this situation when everybody is in the mob, there are always going to be the weaker ones, who can't help themselves when they see a competitive price.

The game is not new, it's built up on experience, if NPC prices were removed, steel price rockets, therefore more people make their own, demand falls, price falls. Leave it as it is, there is a nice mix of buyers and sellers.

[Guest]

That is a very good point bkxxl, I second that.

[Guest]

i believe in a free market. and i think that is the main ideea behind this game. and the price for steel on the market is now setup by NPC Corp. and this isn't a free market.

it's true that the newcomers would find building and expanding difficult if the steel price would increase. i remember getting cheap stuff as i was noob. like apples @ 0.1 or 0.5 and something like that. what if newcomers would get the option to buy steel @ 135 like that. and, for the rest of the people, lets say ppl that played kapilands for 2 weeks or ppl that passed the 1st level and have a cash+fixed assets of more than 2 millions, they would have to buy it from the market. you can still keep the NPC corp but make it sell steel W 145 or 150. im not even sure the price would rise. cus im almost sure many ppl would invest in making steel when they see the price increase. than the offer would overcome the request and the price would go down. this is how a free market is supposed to work and not have NPC Corp setting up the price.

[Guest]

i believe in a free market. and i think that is the main ideea behind this game. and the price for steel on the market is now setup by NPC Corp. and this isn't a free market.

Yes but in that real world free market I can make a building out of just stones, or just wood, or out of aluminum or anything else. The requirement is an arbitrary one set by the game. Making NPC steel available is merely a counterbalance to making steel so necessary in the first place.

[Guest]

Ignore me if my reviving another thread aggravates you- I can't seem to let go of such fascinating ones.

It seems to me that an earlier suggestion in this thread slipped by unnoticed but neatly closed the divide- making the NPCs cost more per level. Although I was actually going to suggest that they just exist until Manager level (or whatever the KapiGods deem an appropriate level) then are unavailable.

After all, surely at that point they are more than capable of paying more, producing their own or even just relying on the noob market (which, I think we should all remember, doesn't just include those who start by producing it, but those who realise they can sell their starter steel).

That would make the market a bit more free, but still allow noobs to develop at a reasonable pace (though again, it should be pointed out that they start with enough steel and the other products to develope a long way first- selling it is their choice), which is what Tycoon indicated was the whole point.

Also, as opposed to Tycoons portent, if this level-bias NPC were implemented, the situation would be much the same as now- smart noobs put below the NPC (allowing old-timers to buy below the NPC anyway) and ignorant noobs (being tactful here) would try to sell above, as they seem to be doing now for no understandable reason.

The main reason I am posting in this thread though, is because Widgetry is perfectly correct it stating that the producers reasons should be fully explained, and then taken, examined, and aired by anyone who wants without being scolded like naughty children.

Expecially because surely the biggest complement to any intellectual property is engagement. With engagement, we show appreciation and advance. The ones not engaged with by others are superficial, useless, crazy or bias- so go KapiGods!

And I have also felt that to some extent the game is more than tightly-controlled- for example it is impossible to trade with someone at the same IP. For obvious reasons, of course, and the alternative is more than difficult to implement for thousands of players, but to be branded a cheater and completely deleted for it? My roommate and I are addicted- so this is frustrating.

Anyway, I don't really mind if anyone reads this, just felt I'd take my mainly democratic right to blab for hours. Just like real politicians!

[Guest]

If somebody (maintainers, Knolls, me, anybody with a smidgen of time and savvy with spreadsheets) were to publish a chart with average company value over time (the expansion rate), each player could check for themselves which companies (players) are probable cheaters and start boycotting them

Hehe, just look for the vertical line. The cheaters are the ones going from 500,000 to 4mil in an hour.

However there are other reasons why moves can happen. I personally made a huge jump just at the start of once contest because I had a warehouse full of the contest product. That stuff can happen frequently (to say nothing of coin purchases) so when I've suspected someone I always report to the mods as "please investigate, this looks funny." We need someone who can see behind the scenes to know for sure. If all we had were players guessing and boycotting that's kind of a mob justice.

I see what you're saying, that enjoyment is a psychological thing. Instead of needing to be the biggest, players can play for being the biggest candymaker, or the fastest-growing Small Businessman, or just to feel like they're expanding regardless of other players. With that mindset you just append to "largest non-cheating candymaker" and the like.

However, I've found that's a triumph of logic over emotions that most people just can't handle. It's one thing to say "well people started before me so it's ok that they're ahead." But something else to see people jumping by because they're not obeying the rules. And it would nag in everyone's head that they're spending time looking carefully to save a few caps on the market when they could just as easily load up on cheated steel.

Also a public boycott is a lot of effort, we'd have to pass around blacklists all the time (again approaching mob justice). Considering you can still progress in solo mode, and you can't keep people from buying off the market, I don't think that's a viable solution.

True, you can get a lof of money in a contest, 1-2mill maybe ?? or maybe more, but what when the constest finish ??? you dont gonna win that in a week if you are a new player.
About the NPC, i think its ok all ppl who say raise the npc price its because they sell steel or any related product, i produce stell and some other products from stell, i sell steel too sometimes, but i dont gonna say raise NPC steel price !!!! i wanna get bigger profits !!! you gain good profits this way, you wanna get bigger profits ??? make a product from steel and you gonna get bigger profits, new players (like me) traying to expand or create any building gonna be stuck for weeks to make the money to buy the steel if price go up a lot, then new players gonna get bored because they cant grow and gonna quit. ok ok too long DONT TOUCH NOTHING NPC ARE OK !!!